Sachs Clutch (possible trouble)

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CarGuru > Volkswagen > Sachs Clutch (possible trouble) 22 April 2005 02:25:38

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Sachs Clutch (possible trouble)
Tom Nakashima 20 April 2005 17:47:43
	I'm 0 for 2 on the Sachs Clutch recently. Stock '66 VW Beetle They start out fine, then the chattering occurs in 1st and reverse gear after a few days. Two mechanics actually drove my car and think it's the Sachs Clutch (pressure plate) and tell me to get rid of that piece of junk and put in the German Clutch. Other's have said Sach clutches are fine, and think I should examine the flywheel for flatness and to take a cut if necessary. New Sachs bearing, clutch disk, and pressure plate. Any other suggestions on what look into? Bent rod? -tom
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Mic 20 April 2005 18:09:39 [ permanent link ]
	examine the flywheel for flatness and to take a cut if necessary. New > Sachs> bearing, clutch disk, and pressure plate. Any other suggestions on what > look> into? Bent rod? Sachs is the nr. 1 german quality product. I would look for a defekt clutchkabel. Maybee some strands of wire a broken. That gives a "spongy" cable. Look for oil on the clutch parts.... bye from Denmark....Michael
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Tom Nakashima 20 April 2005 19:06:06 [ permanent link ]
	"MIC" <NO@spamSERVER.COM> wrote in message news:426662a8$0$73778$edfadb0f@dread14.news.tele.dk...> > examine the flywheel for flatness and to take a cut if necessary. New> > Sachs> > bearing, clutch disk, and pressure plate. Any other suggestions on what> > look> > into? Bent rod?> Sachs is the nr. 1 german quality product.> I would look for a defekt clutchkabel. Maybee some strands of wire a broken.> That gives a "spongy" cable.> Look for oil on the clutch parts....> bye from Denmark....Michael> The clutch cable is new. It's possible it could be the rear main seal, there is leakage in that area. So I'm now assuming engine oil is getting on the clutch disk, this is causing it to chatter in 1st and reverse gear? -tom
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Remco 20 April 2005 19:37:54 [ permanent link ]
	I'm 0 for 2 on the Sachs Clutch recently. Stock '66 VW Beetle They start> out fine, then the chattering occurs in 1st and reverse gear after a few> days. Two mechanics actually drove my car and think it's the Sachs Clutch> (pressure plate) and tell me to get rid of that piece of junk and put in German Clutch. Other's have said Sach clutches are fine, and think I should> examine the flywheel for flatness and to take a cut if necessary. New Sachs> bearing, clutch disk, and pressure plate. Any other suggestions on what look> into? Bent rod? Could it be that the bend in the clutch cable is missing or not large enough (right after it comes out of the tunnel)? Maybe the clutch cable is flopping around in the tunnel? Remco
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Speedy Jim 20 April 2005 19:40:59 [ permanent link ]
	Tom Nakashima wrote: "MIC" <NO@spamSERVER.COM> wrote in message> news:426662a8$0$73778$edfadb0f@dread14.news.tele.dk...> examine the flywheel for flatness and to take a cut if necessary. New>>>Sachs>>>bearing, clutch disk, and pressure plate. Any other suggestions on what>>>look>>>into? Bent rod?>> Sachs is the nr. 1 german quality product.>>I would look for a defekt clutchkabel. Maybee some strands of wire a> broken.> That gives a "spongy" cable.>>Look for oil on the clutch parts....>>bye from Denmark....Michael>> The clutch cable is new. It's possible it could be the rear main seal,> there is leakage in that area. So I'm now assuming engine oil is getting on> the clutch disk, this is causing it to chatter in 1st and reverse gear?> -tom> Could be oil. Bad tranny mounts (frt and rear) will also cause very bad chatter. Or Bowden (flex) tube for cable does not have enough "bend" in it. The friction of the cable inside the Bowden tube acts as a damper. Speedy Jim http://www.nls.net/mp/volks/
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Jan Andersson 20 April 2005 19:55:52 [ permanent link ]
	Tom Nakashima wrote:> "MIC" <NO@spamSERVER.COM> wrote in message> news:426662a8$0$73778$edfadb0f@dread14.news.tele.dk...> > > examine the flywheel for flatness and to take a cut if necessary. New> > > Sachs> > > bearing, clutch disk, and pressure plate. Any other suggestions on what> > > look> > > into? Bent rod?> > Sachs is the nr. 1 german quality product.> > I would look for a defekt clutchkabel. Maybee some strands of wire a> broken.> > That gives a "spongy" cable.> > Look for oil on the clutch parts....> > bye from Denmark....Michael> > The clutch cable is new. It's possible it could be the rear main seal,> there is leakage in that area. So I'm now assuming engine oil is getting on> the clutch disk, this is causing it to chatter in 1st and reverse gear?> -tom Is there enough bend in the bowden tube? The flexible tube that the cable goes through between the car body and the "ear" on the side of the gearbox? It has to have a very clear U shape. Jan
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Shag 21 April 2005 00:47:43 [ permanent link ]
	On Wed, 20 Apr 2005 08:06:06 -0700, "Tom Nakashima" <tom@slac.stanford.edu> wrote: "MIC" <NO@spamSERVER.COM> wrote in message>news:426662a8$0$73778$edfadb0f@dread14.news.tele.dk...>> > examine the flywheel for flatness and to take a cut if necessary. New>> > Sachs>> > bearing, clutch disk, and pressure plate. Any other suggestions on what>> > look>> > into? Bent rod?>> Sachs is the nr. 1 german quality product.>> I would look for a defekt clutchkabel. Maybee some strands of wire a>broken.>> That gives a "spongy" cable.>> Look for oil on the clutch parts....>> bye from Denmark....Michael>> The clutch cable is new. It's possible it could be the rear main seal,>there is leakage in that area. So I'm now assuming engine oil is getting on>the clutch disk, this is causing it to chatter in 1st and reverse gear?>-tom> I had the same symptom of chattering going into first and reverse. Mine DID turn out to be oil getting on the clutch disk. If you have leakage there then I'd look at that before I started worrying about how much of a bend your bowden tube has in it and the transmission mounts. I mean you're gonna have to fix the leak anyway, right? Might as well fix it and put in a clutch with no oil on it because those things are going to have to be done anyway. If that doesn't fix it, then....... "Stupid people are funny." - me
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Tom Nakashima 21 April 2005 01:09:01 [ permanent link ]
	"Shag" <travist67_REMOVETHIS_@gmail.com> wrote in message news:erfd61tssvbdp7591064ngch1s6m72vs79@4ax.com...> On Wed, 20 Apr 2005 08:06:06 -0700, "Tom Nakashima"> <tom@slac.stanford.edu> wrote:> "MIC" <NO@spamSERVER.COM> wrote in message> >news:426662a8$0$73778$edfadb0f@dread14.news.tele.dk...> >> > examine the flywheel for flatness and to take a cut if necessary. New> >> > Sachs> >> > bearing, clutch disk, and pressure plate. Any other suggestions on what> >> > look> >> > into? Bent rod?> >> Sachs is the nr. 1 german quality product.> >> I would look for a defekt clutchkabel. Maybee some strands of wire a> >broken.> >> That gives a "spongy" cable.> >> Look for oil on the clutch parts....> >> bye from Denmark....Michael> >> The clutch cable is new. It's possible it could be the rear main seal,> >there is leakage in that area. So I'm now assuming engine oil is getting the clutch disk, this is causing it to chatter in 1st and reverse gear?> >-tom> > I had the same symptom of chattering going into first and reverse.> Mine DID turn out to be oil getting on the clutch disk. If you have> leakage there then I'd look at that before I started worrying about> how much of a bend your bowden tube has in it and the transmission> mounts. I mean you're gonna have to fix the leak anyway, right?> Might as well fix it and put in a clutch with no oil on it because> those things are going to have to be done anyway. If that doesn't fix> it, then.......> "Stupid people are funny." - me Thanks Shag for your input, I will fix the leak (new seal) and have a look at the flywheel, at least get an indicator on there to check the runout. Hopefully 3-times a charm. -tom
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Speedy Jim 21 April 2005 01:20:09 [ permanent link ]
	Tom Nakashima wrote: Thanks Shag for your input, I will fix the leak (new seal) and have a look> at the flywheel, at least get an indicator on there to check the runout.> Hopefully 3-times a charm.> -tom> Whilst the indicator is out, double check the endplay. Speedy Jim http://www.nls.net/mp/volks/
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Joey Tribiani 21 April 2005 02:57:49 [ permanent link ]
	"Tom Nakashima" <tom@slac.stanford.edu> wrote in message news:d46gde$81b$1@news.Stanford.EDU... Thanks Shag for your input, I will fix the leak (new seal) and have a look> at the flywheel, at least get an indicator on there to check the runout.> Hopefully 3-times a charm.> -tom> Tom as Speedy Jim says also check the endplay on the crankshaft(before you remove the flywheel...when you install the new seal make sure to put some oil or grease on the "lip" of it or the "snout" of the pressure plate(grease if you don't plan on starting it up soon)...a "dry start" on the flywheel seal can distort it and it will never seal properly....also check the area that the seal "rides" on the flywheel snout for burrs or grooves....when the engine is out check the rear transaxle mounts by prying up on the transaxle with a stout prybar...any signs of cracking or dry rot are grounds for replacement...(you need the engine out to replace these so it is a good time to check)....one other thing no one has mentioned is to check that the "arms" on the clutch release "fork" in the transaxle are parallel with each other...if they are not and one of the "arms" is bent it can put an uneven force on the centerring and cause a chatter....
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dave AKA vwdoc1 21 April 2005 07:11:20 [ permanent link ]
	I have seen this caused by: bad trans/motor mounts, bad pressure plates, bad/warped clutch discs, badly machined flywheels, bad release bearings or their forks, bad bowden tubes, bad welds or broked clutch tubes inside the tunnel (COMMONLY OVERLOOKED), bad engine freeplay etc. BTW Sachs makes good stuff usually! JMHO dave (One out of many daves)
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Tom Nakashima 21 April 2005 17:43:49 [ permanent link ]
	"Joey Tribiani" <noway@home.com> wrote in message news:Y7B9e.14592$Z73.12706@lakeread04...> "Tom Nakashima" <tom@slac.stanford.edu> wrote in message> news:d46gde$81b$1@news.Stanford.EDU...> Thanks Shag for your input, I will fix the leak (new seal) and have a look> > at the flywheel, at least get an indicator on there to check the runout.> > Hopefully 3-times a charm.> > -tom> > Tom as Speedy Jim says also check the endplay on the crankshaft(before you> remove the flywheel...when you install the new seal make sure to put some> oil or grease on the "lip" of it or the "snout" of the pressure plate(grease> if you don't plan on starting it up soon)...a "dry start" on the flywheel> seal can distort it and it will never seal properly....also check the area> that the seal "rides" on the flywheel snout for burrs or grooves....when engine is out check the rear transaxle mounts by prying up on the transaxle> with a stout prybar...any signs of cracking or dry rot are grounds for> replacement...(you need the engine out to replace these so it is a good time> to check)....one other thing no one has mentioned is to check that the> "arms" on the clutch release "fork" in the transaxle are parallel with each> other...if they are not and one of the "arms" is bent it can put an uneven> force on the centerring and cause a chatter....> Joey, You guys really have great mechanical expertise on VW's, better than the manuals I've been referring to. There are somethings that the manual doesn't tell you, but should know just from experience. thanks again, -tom
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Tom Nakashima 21 April 2005 18:40:12 [ permanent link ]
	"dave AKA vwdoc1" <vwdoc1@ameritech.net> wrote in message news:sRE9e.1051$fw2.919@newssvr33.news.prodigy.com...> I have seen this caused by:> bad trans/motor mounts,> bad pressure plates,> bad/warped clutch discs,> badly machined flywheels,> bad release bearings or their forks,> bad bowden tubes,> bad welds or broked clutch tubes inside the tunnel (COMMONLY OVERLOOKED),> bad engine freeplay> etc.> BTW Sachs makes good stuff usually!> JMHO> dave> (One out of many daves)> Thanks Dave, so many things to look at, some I would have never considered, but will try to pin-point the problem. -tom
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Howard Rose 21 April 2005 22:10:24 [ permanent link ]
	On Wed, 20 Apr 2005 06:47:43 -0700, "Tom Nakashima" <tom@slac.stanford.edu> wrote: I'm 0 for 2 on the Sachs Clutch recently. Stock '66 VW Beetle They start>out fine, then the chattering occurs in 1st and reverse gear after a few>days. Two mechanics actually drove my car and think it's the Sachs Clutch>(pressure plate) and tell me to get rid of that piece of junk and put in the>German Clutch. Other's have said Sach clutches are fine, and think I should>examine the flywheel for flatness and to take a cut if necessary. New Sachs>bearing, clutch disk, and pressure plate. Any other suggestions on what look>into? Bent rod?>-tom I believe the clutch plate in my '66 was replaced with Sach one at 42,000 miles in 2002, as well as the through out bearing and whatever the third part is called. I'm not on 50,000 and all seems fine... Maybe it is not aligned properly? -- Howard Rose 1966 VW Beetle 1300 Deluxe 1962 Austin Mini Deluxe 1964 Austin Mini Super Deluxe http://www.howard81.co.uk/ (cars on website)
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Joey Tribiani 22 April 2005 02:25:38 [ permanent link ]
	"Tom Nakashima" <tom@slac.stanford.edu> wrote in message news:d48amm$2n$1@news.Stanford.EDU...> You guys really have great mechanical expertise on VW's, better than the> manuals I've been referring to. There are somethings that the manual doesn't> tell you, but should know just from experience.> thanks again,> -tom> you bet Tom...the collective knowledge here in this group is something a manual can never touch....
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CarGuru > Volkswagen > Sachs Clutch (possible trouble) 22 April 2005 02:25:38

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Sachs Clutch (possible trouble)

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