Noisy Vehicle Law

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Noisy Vehicle Law
Skip Elliott Bowman 8 March 2005 23:08:41
	You'll be happy to know that an Oregon state legislator, Mitch Greenlick (D-Portland) introduced a bill that would make the production of unnecessarily loud noise on a vehicle an offense, punishable by a fine of up to $720. If you're interested, it's House Bill 2822.
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Alex Rodriguez 9 March 2005 02:32:43 [ permanent link ]
	In article <ZKmXd.3961$oO4.3244@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net>, skipster@teleport.com says...>You'll be happy to know that an Oregon state legislator, Mitch Greenlick >(D-Portland) introduced a bill that would make the production of >unnecessarily loud noise on a vehicle an offense, punishable by a fine of up >to $720.>If you're interested, it's House Bill 2822. Are there really no other laws in place that could curtail loud vehicles? ---------------- Alex
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Larry Bud 9 March 2005 03:35:20 [ permanent link ]
	Alex Rodriguez wrote:> In article <ZKmXd.3961$oO4.3244@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net>,> skipster@teleport.com says...> >You'll be happy to know that an Oregon state legislator, Mitch Greenlick> >(D-Portland) introduced a bill that would make the production of> >unnecessarily loud noise on a vehicle an offense, punishable by a fine of up> >to $720.> >If you're interested, it's House Bill 2822.> Are there really no other laws in place that could curtail loud vehicles? I'm sure there are... just no other laws to put an extra $720 in government coffers.
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Allen Seth Dunn 9 March 2005 03:38:21 [ permanent link ]
	"Larry Bud" <larrybud2002@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:1110324920.010271.319430@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...> Alex Rodriguez wrote:>> In article <ZKmXd.3961$oO4.3244@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net>,>> skipster@teleport.com says...>> >You'll be happy to know that an Oregon state legislator, Mitch> Greenlick>> >(D-Portland) introduced a bill that would make the production of>> >unnecessarily loud noise on a vehicle an offense, punishable by a> fine of up>> >to $720.>> >If you're interested, it's House Bill 2822.>> Are there really no other laws in place that could curtail loud> vehicles?> I'm sure there are... just no other laws to put an extra $720 in> government coffers.> I would love to see this happen, but then, I don't think this law is really that enforcable.
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Daniel J. Stern 9 March 2005 04:27:08 [ permanent link ]
	You'll be happy to know that an Oregon state legislator, Mitch Greenlick> (D-Portland) introduced a bill that would make the production of> unnecessarily loud noise on a vehicle an offense, punishable by a fine> of up to $720. If you're interested, it's House Bill 2822. Uh-huh. Except that laws which contain terms like "unnecessarily loud" or "unnecessarily bright" or "unnecessarily glaring" are unenforceable, 'cause there's no objective standard of what constitutes "unnecessary". DS
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Skip Elliott Bowman 9 March 2005 05:47:29 [ permanent link ]
	"Daniel J. Stern" <dastern@127.0.0.1> wrote in message newsine.GSO.4.58.0503081926020.10673@alumni.engin.umich.edu...> You'll be happy to know that an Oregon state legislator, Mitch Greenlick>> (D-Portland) introduced a bill that would make the production of>> unnecessarily loud noise on a vehicle an offense, punishable by a fine>> of up to $720. If you're interested, it's House Bill 2822.> Uh-huh. Except that laws which contain terms like "unnecessarily loud" or> "unnecessarily bright" or "unnecessarily glaring" are unenforceable,> 'cause there's no objective standard of what constitutes "unnecessary". That's just a logistics problem--when and if it passes out of committee, all they'll need to do is set a decibel level threshold. Thurston County in Washington State did this in the 1980s and enforced it assiduously. We've already decided what's unnecessary here on the board
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N8n 9 March 2005 06:43:07 [ permanent link ]
	Daniel J. Stern wrote:> > You'll be happy to know that an Oregon state legislator, Mitch Greenlick> > (D-Portland) introduced a bill that would make the production of> > unnecessarily loud noise on a vehicle an offense, punishable by a fine> > of up to $720. If you're interested, it's House Bill 2822.> Uh-huh. Except that laws which contain terms like "unnecessarily loud" or> "unnecessarily bright" or "unnecessarily glaring" are unenforceable,> 'cause there's no objective standard of what constitutes "unnecessary".> DS Well, there's already standards, or at least guidelines for "unnecessarily glaring..." Oh, right. I'll shut up now. nate
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Zmike6 9 March 2005 09:04:53 [ permanent link ]
	On Tue, 08 Mar 2005 19:08:41 GMT, "Skip Elliott Bowman" <skipster@teleport.com> wrote: You'll be happy to know that an Oregon state legislator, Mitch Greenlick >(D-Portland) introduced a bill that would make the production of >unnecessarily loud noise on a vehicle an offense, punishable by a fine of up >to $720.> If you're interested, it's House Bill 2822.> What's the fine for a neighbor's loud barking dog in Oregon? That's much more annoying than the temporary noise of a loud vehicle driving by. If the fine for vehicles is $720, I'd make the fine for barking dogs $720 per day (or per bark).
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Cory Dunkle 9 March 2005 18:04:07 [ permanent link ]
	"Skip Elliott Bowman" <skipster@teleport.com> wrote in message news:ZKmXd.3961$oO4.3244@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net...> You'll be happy to know that an Oregon state legislator, Mitch Greenlick> (D-Portland) introduced a bill that would make the production of> unnecessarily loud noise on a vehicle an offense, punishable by a fine of to $720.> If you're interested, it's House Bill 2822. Interesting. Truckers may get into trouble with this one if it is equally and fairly enforced. Also, hopefully those rude people who think it's fun to honk the horn every time they lock their car will get plenty of fines. Or heck, maybe the liberals will grow a brain and perhaps decide it would be best to grow up about this stuff and maybe... just maybe, like in a country where we have some freedoms left. I doubt that'll ever happen though.
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Tcs 9 March 2005 19:16:23 [ permanent link ]
	On Wed, 09 Mar 2005 05:04:53 GMT, zmike6 <zmike6@SPAMBLOCKyahoo.com> wrote:>On Tue, 08 Mar 2005 19:08:41 GMT, "Skip Elliott Bowman"><skipster@teleport.com> wrote: You'll be happy to know that an Oregon state legislator, Mitch Greenlick >>(D-Portland) introduced a bill that would make the production of >>unnecessarily loud noise on a vehicle an offense, punishable by a fine of up >>to $720.>> If you're interested, it's House Bill 2822.>> What's the fine for a neighbor's loud barking dog in Oregon? That's>much more annoying than the temporary noise of a loud vehicle driving>by. If the fine for vehicles is $720, I'd make the fine for barking>dogs $720 per day (or per bark). About $0 for the first ticket with a warning; $60 for the next; about $200 for the next and possible jail after that.
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Daniel J. Stern 9 March 2005 20:12:26 [ permanent link ]
	On Wed, 9 Mar 2005, TCS wrote: Uh-huh. Except that laws which contain terms like "unnecessarily loud"> >or "unnecessarily bright" or "unnecessarily glaring" are unenforceable,> >'cause there's no objective standard of what constitutes "unnecessary". I bet if I were to fit a firetruck's air horn to my car and pull up to> your driveway and hit it at 6am, you'd have a pretty good idea if it was> "unnecessarily loud." Right, "disturbing the peace". There a gray area where you can't draw the line, but it's simple to> detect when on the other side of the gray area. Are you sure? Most jurists seem to think grey areas are unconstitutionally vague, viz. Montana.
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Alex Rodriguez 9 March 2005 23:12:57 [ permanent link ]
	In article <mbydnYxUppGhn7LfRVn-2A@comcast.com>, cdnews@comcast.net says...> "Skip Elliott Bowman" <skipster@teleport.com> wrote in message>news:ZKmXd.3961$oO4.3244@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net...>> You'll be happy to know that an Oregon state legislator, Mitch Greenlick>> (D-Portland) introduced a bill that would make the production of>> unnecessarily loud noise on a vehicle an offense, punishable by a fine of>up>> to $720.>> If you're interested, it's House Bill 2822.> Interesting. Truckers may get into trouble with this one if it is equally>and fairly enforced. Also, hopefully those rude people who think it's fun to>honk the horn every time they lock their car will get plenty of fines. Or>heck, maybe the liberals will grow a brain and perhaps decide it would be>best to grow up about this stuff and maybe... just maybe, like in a country>where we have some freedoms left. I doubt that'll ever happen though. You can also see how this could be abused. A cop walks up to you and wants to know who you are and where you are going. His excuse will be that he saw you walk out of the car that just made some unecessary noise. ------------- Alex
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Matthew Russotto 10 March 2005 20:26:16 [ permanent link ]
	In article <RAsXd.4135$oO4.2@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net>, Skip Elliott Bowman <skipster@teleport.com> wrote:>"Daniel J. Stern" <dastern@127.0.0.1> wrote in message >newsine.GSO.4.58.0503081926020.10673@alumni.engin.umich.edu...>> You'll be happy to know that an Oregon state legislator, Mitch Greenlick>>> (D-Portland) introduced a bill that would make the production of>>> unnecessarily loud noise on a vehicle an offense, punishable by a fine>>> of up to $720. If you're interested, it's House Bill 2822.>> Uh-huh. Except that laws which contain terms like "unnecessarily loud" or>> "unnecessarily bright" or "unnecessarily glaring" are unenforceable,>> 'cause there's no objective standard of what constitutes "unnecessary".> That's just a logistics problem Has nothing to do with logistics --when and if it passes out of committee, all >they'll need to do is set a decibel level threshold. Which has nothing to do with necessity. -- There's no such thing as a free lunch, but certain accounting practices can result in a fully-depreciated one.
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Big Bill 10 March 2005 22:15:51 [ permanent link ]
	On Thu, 10 Mar 2005 17:22:10 GMT, "Skip Elliott Bowman" <skipster@teleport.com> wrote: "Matthew Russotto" <russotto@grace.speakeasy.net> wrote in message >news:q92dnUdqYbS16K3fRVn-qA@speakeasy.net...>> In article <RAsXd.4135$oO4.2@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net>,>> Skip Elliott Bowman <skipster@teleport.com> wrote:>>>"Daniel J. Stern" <dastern@127.0.0.1> wrote in message>>>newsine.GSO.4.58.0503081926020.10673@alumni.engin.umich.edu...>>>> You'll be happy to know that an Oregon state legislator, Mitch >>>>> Greenlick>>>>> (D-Portland) introduced a bill that would make the production of>>>>> unnecessarily loud noise on a vehicle an offense, punishable by a fine>>>>> of up to $720. If you're interested, it's House Bill 2822.>>>> Uh-huh. Except that laws which contain terms like "unnecessarily loud" >>>> or>>>> "unnecessarily bright" or "unnecessarily glaring" are unenforceable,>>>> 'cause there's no objective standard of what constitutes "unnecessary".>>> That's just a logistics problem>> Has nothing to do with logistics> Huh? He's saying that "unnecessarily" is too vague (subjective) to be used in a law. Once you define your terms in terms of a measurable unit, you've gone from subjectibve to objective.> --when and if it passes out of committee, all>>>they'll need to do is set a decibel level threshold.>> Which has nothing to do with necessity.> Neither of your responses made a lick of sense, Matthew. I take it at least >you don't live next to a property that uses gas-powered leaf blowers at 7 >am? > -- Bill Funk Change "g" to "a"
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Skip Elliott Bowman 10 March 2005 22:21:40 [ permanent link ]
	"Big Bill" <bill@pipping.com> wrote in message news:7k31311a52ivk2e03emtgp1a59aqeej1rr@4ax.com...> On Thu, 10 Mar 2005 17:22:10 GMT, "Skip Elliott Bowman"> <skipster@teleport.com> wrote:> "Matthew Russotto" <russotto@grace.speakeasy.net> wrote in message>>news:q92dnUdqYbS16K3fRVn-qA@speakeasy.net...>>> In article <RAsXd.4135$oO4.2@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net>,>>> Skip Elliott Bowman <skipster@teleport.com> wrote:>>>>"Daniel J. Stern" <dastern@127.0.0.1> wrote in message>>>>newsine.GSO.4.58.0503081926020.10673@alumni.engin.umich.edu...>>>>> You'll be happy to know that an Oregon state legislator, Mitch>>>>>> Greenlick>>>>>> (D-Portland) introduced a bill that would make the production of>>>>>> unnecessarily loud noise on a vehicle an offense, punishable by a >>>>>> fine>>>>>> of up to $720. If you're interested, it's House Bill 2822.>>>>> Uh-huh. Except that laws which contain terms like "unnecessarily loud">>>>> or>>>>> "unnecessarily bright" or "unnecessarily glaring" are unenforceable,>>>>> 'cause there's no objective standard of what constitutes >>>>> "unnecessary".>>>> That's just a logistics problem>>> Has nothing to do with logistics>> Huh?> He's saying that "unnecessarily" is too vague (subjective) to be used> in a law.> Once you define your terms in terms of a measurable unit, you've gone> from subjectibve to objective.>> --when and if it passes out of committee, all>>>>they'll need to do is set a decibel level threshold.>>> Which has nothing to do with necessity.>> Neither of your responses made a lick of sense, Matthew. I take it at >>least>>you don't live next to a property that uses gas-powered leaf blowers at 7>>am? As you can see, I clarified my answer in the same post. Nevertheless, thanks Bill.
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Matthew Russotto 11 March 2005 01:29:41 [ permanent link ]
	In article <6n%Xd.5135$oO4.4791@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net>, Skip Elliott Bowman <skipster@teleport.com> wrote:>"Matthew Russotto" <russotto@grace.speakeasy.net> wrote in message >news:q92dnUdqYbS16K3fRVn-qA@speakeasy.net...>> In article <RAsXd.4135$oO4.2@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net>,>> Skip Elliott Bowman <skipster@teleport.com> wrote:>>>"Daniel J. Stern" <dastern@127.0.0.1> wrote in message>>>newsine.GSO.4.58.0503081926020.10673@alumni.engin.umich.edu...>>>> You'll be happy to know that an Oregon state legislator, Mitch >>>>> Greenlick>>>>> (D-Portland) introduced a bill that would make the production of>>>>> unnecessarily loud noise on a vehicle an offense, punishable by a fine>>>>> of up to $720. If you're interested, it's House Bill 2822.>>>> Uh-huh. Except that laws which contain terms like "unnecessarily loud" >>>> or>>>> "unnecessarily bright" or "unnecessarily glaring" are unenforceable,>>>> 'cause there's no objective standard of what constitutes "unnecessary".>>> That's just a logistics problem>> Has nothing to do with logistics> Huh? The problem of setting a "necessity" standard is not a logistical one. --when and if it passes out of committee, all>>>they'll need to do is set a decibel level threshold.>> Which has nothing to do with necessity.> Neither of your responses made a lick of sense, Matthew. I take it at least >you don't live next to a property that uses gas-powered leaf blowers at 7 >am? A law setting a decibel level threshold for noise is not one which restricts "unnecessary" noise; there's no necessity test in such a threshold. -- There's no such thing as a free lunch, but certain accounting practices can result in a fully-depreciated one.
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Noisy Vehicle Law

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